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GrandMasterGalvatron
Ok, let's cut to the chase. I've been suspending disbelief while watching this show for the longest time, but this finale doesn't make sense even by this show's conventions.

For a show that at least halfway pretends to be realistic, saying that villainy is genetic is a huge stretch. Especially when 90% of the show's villains weren't generally evil people, but got screwed over by *insert person/situation here*

But even with that malarkey, the ultimate solution to global crime is to push a button and all the evil magically goes away...




Seriously, what kind of crack were they smoking when they came up with this?

Irritation aside, the two parter has a very strong starting, and even the final boss battle (which really reeks of a super sonic boss in the Sonic games) was pretty cool. Of course, there is always plus points for Britney being there, and there was a really good shocker with the truth about Jerry's Mom.

I also appreciated using Mandy's and Britney's Season 1/2 themes, and for the team finally owning up to erasing Mandy's memories a million times.

There's also quite a bit of fanservice here as well, with the flashback scene, and the manual applying of the spy suits.

Overall I think for a series finale, it's actually pretty weak. It's like they tried to go out with a bang, but then chickened out in the last moment. I'm still gonna be sore about the flanderization of Blaine, as well as the fact that Clover jumped right on him like she hadn't been with a man since he'd been gone. There's also Mindy absent with no explanation at all.

Oh, and this thing kinda screws up the timing on TAS as well. If they're gonna last more than two seasons, they're gonna have to address the gene thing at some point. Though I'd prefer the whole thing be retconned but w/e.
Trillium
QUOTE (GrandMasterGalvatron @ Jun 1 2010, 04:32 PM) *
But even with that malarkey, the ultimate solution to global crime is to push a button and all the evil magically goes away...




Seriously, what kind of crack were they smoking when they came up with this?


I want to give them points for actually trying to do a proper series finale with an ending rather than just ending it out of nowhere (or getting some sort of "Alf" screwjob) but that ending is BULLSHIT. It's like they wanted to end it, had no idea and went "Durr, let's just eliminate all evil! Than they won't need WOOHP no more!"
Ryofu
Over all

Ignoring the moronic ending, that while TS-esque in it's utter-ridiculousness is still irritating, I didn't like this episode much. Part 1 was much better.

Things that sucked other than the "conclusion"

One thing that I felt sucked is that they have Britney, Blaine, and Dean in the episode and they basically do nothing but get tentacle raped for ten minutes.

I'm also kinda annoyed the Samdyness wasn't apparent in this episode like the last one, and I'm really pissed off they treated her so badly at the end there with Clover even making a crack about wiping her brain all the time. Ugh.

Only good things

Mandy had a decent amount of speaking part in this episode. I'm glad at least she didn't get ignored in this supposed finale.

I found Mandy's crack about the robot being "Mr. Gropey" both funny and pretty freaking edgy even for TS. Thumbs up on that at least.

Jerry's mom was smoking hot in the past. Although that's kinda creepy since she has to be like 90 now. She also resembled Pam strangely.

Most creepy moments

Blaine trying to make out with Clover in the basement. And Blaine calling her Clovey. Ughhh. He does realize she's been fucking behind his back for the past 13 or so episodes, right? I guess he really likes sloppy seconds.
Kitty
I pretty much agree with Syxxy on almost everything xD Like, I saw some of part 1, and when I realized that part 2 was the finale, I was SOOO disappointed :S Like, it wasn't a bad episode, but for a finale, it was pretty anti-climatic. They should have had ALL the WOOHP spies do stuff instead of just Sam, Alex, and Clover D: And why did they randomly act so mean to Mandy at the end too?? Like, I don't even like Mandy but it seriously bothered me O_o;

They could've made it sooooo much better lmao...
Mezoroth
I think between this kinda screw over ending and a spin-off series that's about as far away as possible from what we wanted (granted, it's not Totally Dean or anything, so sigh of relief), I suspect that this was Marathon's attempt at trolling us.

Which I have to admit, I'll tip my hat to it, cuz I do love a good troll. XD
deadmanOmega
Nice season ending episode with most of the main charcters included and some new ones as well like Blaine. Also very sad episode for me. As all good things it must came to an end and we can't have every thing we want. sad.gif
CrowSama
I dislike the fact that they erradicate all evil from the world with a single press of the button. Then there's the fact that Britney, David and the other guy are there and they just stand around when they should be HELPING. WTF are they thinking??
David: *wow Clover is so hot I'm gonna tap that so hard tonight*
Britney: *wow Alex is so hot I'm gonna tap that so hard tonight*
SERIOUSLY YOU LAZY PPL!! YOU HAVE JETPACKS.
Jerry's Mom: MILF*..... *when she was 20
I think the reason Mindy wasn't present is because she would have argued with Mandy against treating the spies nicely, and wrecked that whole "What the hell is Mandy even here???!" element to the finale.

All-in-all, I want a season 6.... An organization figures out how to recreate the evil gene, and makes an organization of evil spies to try and take out whoop.... and mabye a new hot female head of whoop???
Trillium
QUOTE (CrowSama @ Jul 14 2010, 02:56 PM) *
All-in-all, I want a season 6.... An organization figures out how to recreate the evil gene


We don't even need to do this. Since TS never followed the formula of episode by episode continuity, they could always just randomly go back to High School and call it "TS: The Lost Missions" or something.

I mean, shit, if you watch The Amazing Spiez they say they go on like, Mission 656. I don't know if that's just code or the 656th mission. If it's the latter, TS scrapped the mission barrel at like, 125 of 650.
Ryofu
QUOTE (Trillium @ Jul 15 2010, 12:33 AM) *
QUOTE (CrowSama @ Jul 14 2010, 02:56 PM) *
All-in-all, I want a season 6.... An organization figures out how to recreate the evil gene


We don't even need to do this. Since TS never followed the formula of episode by episode continuity, they could always just randomly go back to High School and call it "TS: The Lost Missions" or something.

I mean, shit, if you watch The Amazing Spiez they say they go on like, Mission 656. I don't know if that's just code or the 656th mission. If it's the latter, TS scrapped the mission barrel at like, 125 of 650.


I don't really know if I want them to do this. I mean having them in high school is great, but we have four seasons of that. Just put those on Bluray and then produce some kind of sequel with the spies + Mandy.

I gotta think if they did a new season like that and just set it during high school again, it would produce so many continuity errors and plot holes, it would be insane.

Maybe they could do another prequel film though. One with Macker the Safe Cracker since their first run in with him has never been animated except via a flashback scene.
CrowSama
QUOTE (J-Syxx @ Jul 15 2010, 01:21 AM) *
Maybe they could do another prequel film though. One with Macker the Safe Cracker since their first run in with him has never been animated except via a flashback scene.


I agree, another film regardless of the villain would be good, but if they do that I think they should do a series of either 3-4 movies, pre or post. The thing is that I just don't want to see TS die out.... but Amazing Spiez can die. tomorrow. smile.gif
Sammie
I agree, this episode was a bit sloppy.

My biggest issue is the way the Mandy plot was handled.

The girls shouldn't have taunted her like they did, and they should've apologized and try to make peace with Mandy. What sort of role models are we setting up for the young viewers, am I right?

Not to mention Jerry living with his Mom is muy creepy. Would Season 1/2 Jerry do that? Hell no!

Ridding the world of the evil gene? Evil is a choice and/or the result of the life you lived! It's not genetic! WTF?
Ryofu
QUOTE (Sammie @ Jul 16 2010, 02:48 PM) *
I agree, this episode was a bit sloppy.

My biggest issue is the way the Mandy plot was handled.

The girls shouldn't have taunted her like they did, and they should've apologized and try to make peace with Mandy. What sort of role models are we setting up for the young viewers, am I right?

Not to mention Jerry living with his Mom is muy creepy. Would Season 1/2 Jerry do that? Hell no!

Ridding the world of the evil gene? Evil is a choice and/or the result of the life you lived! It's not genetic! WTF?


The only thing I disagree with you about is Jerry being a major mama's boy. I think that has definitely been canon since Mommies Dearest in Season 2. So that part of it was definitely believable to me. Jerry is a completely eccentric werido, but I think that's one of the things that makes him interesting. lol

And I was kinda annoyed at how Sam bieng worried about Mandy's safety didn't continue past Part 1. I've probalby already gone over that, but ome how it feels like these episodes weren't written by the same person.

QUOTE
Ridding the world of the evil gene? Evil is a choice and/or the result of the life you lived! It's not genetic! WTF?


Actually this is a very common plot device in films. Just watch Alien 3 or Cat O' Nine Tails. The idea is that a double Y chormosome causes someone to be criminally deviant. It's completely scienc fiction though. And it was still used terrible as a plot device of the worst kind in this episode.
Trillium
QUOTE (Sammie @ Jul 16 2010, 10:48 AM) *
Ridding the world of the evil gene? Evil is a choice and/or the result of the life you lived! It's not genetic! WTF?


Hating TS for science mistakes is silly. If we had a nickle for every time TS basically said "Fuck you laws of science!" we'd all be very rich.

Still a stupid plot device though:p
Ryofu
QUOTE (Trillium @ Jul 16 2010, 10:36 PM) *
QUOTE (Sammie @ Jul 16 2010, 10:48 AM) *
Ridding the world of the evil gene? Evil is a choice and/or the result of the life you lived! It's not genetic! WTF?


Hating TS for science mistakes is silly. If we had a nickle for every time TS basically said "Fuck you laws of science!" we'd all be very rich.

Still a stupid plot device though:p


It's based on old theories. They were mostly disproven though, so its more science fiction now. But this was believed for a short while. From wikipedia:

QUOTE
When chromosome surveys were done in the mid-1960s in British secure hospitals for the developmentally disabled, a higher than expected number of patients were found to have an extra Y chromosome. The patients were mischaracterized as aggressive and criminal, so that for a while an extra Y chromosome was believed to predispose a boy to antisocial behavior (and was dubbed the "criminal karyotype").


Again, I kinda liked this in films like Alien 3 and Cat O' Nine Tails. I don't think it was suggested though that evil people only had the DNA difference. It's just something like a double Y chromosome could produce really anti-social, violent behavior liking making you into a rapist or a serial killer. Maybe being a serial killer being suggested as bieng genetic is similar to wanting to be a super villain in the TS world.

TS of course refers to it as a "villain gene" so it's not the same thing exactly, but similar. People definitely suspect really crazy people of having some kind of DNA difference some how but it's not proven.

However, how this was implemented in the plot and "solved" was absolutely moronic.
CrowSama
QUOTE (J-Syxx @ Jul 16 2010, 09:19 PM) *
It's based on old theories. They were mostly disproven though, so its more science fiction now. But this was believed for a short while. From wikipedia:

QUOTE
When chromosome surveys were done in the mid-1960s in British secure hospitals for the developmentally disabled, a higher than expected number of patients were found to have an extra Y chromosome. The patients were mischaracterized as aggressive and criminal, so that for a while an extra Y chromosome was believed to predispose a boy to antisocial behavior (and was dubbed the "criminal karyotype").


Again, I kinda liked this in films like Alien 3 and Cat O' Nine Tails. I don't think it was suggested though that evil people only had the DNA difference. It's just something like a double Y chromosome could produce really anti-social, violent behavior liking making you into a rapist or a serial killer. Maybe being a serial killer being suggested as bieng genetic is similar to wanting to be a super villain in the TS world.

TS of course refers to it as a "villain gene" so it's not the same thing exactly, but similar. People definitely suspect really crazy people of having some kind of DNA difference some how but it's not proven.

However, how this was implemented in the plot and "solved" was absolutely moronic.


I learned in bio class that having 2 y chromosomes was either really good or really bad... I cant remember, I just remember jotting notes down that day so I dont remember any details. The human mind fascinates me sometimes.

QUOTE
Not to mention Jerry living with his Mom is muy creepy. Would Season 1/2 Jerry do that? Hell no!


I have to agree with Syxx on this one, Sammie. It's been fairly cannon. Though when I stopped watching it for a while, I kind of forgot about it. So when I saw the ending and Jerry was staying with his mom I'm like:
"REALLY!!?!?!? This guy has grey hair and has a GINORMUS bald spot that I really couldn't say was intentional... whatever, the creator obviously just wanted Jerry to represent his life..."
Ryofu
QUOTE (CrowSama @ Jul 17 2010, 03:38 AM) *
QUOTE (J-Syxx @ Jul 16 2010, 09:19 PM) *
It's based on old theories. They were mostly disproven though, so its more science fiction now. But this was believed for a short while. From wikipedia:

QUOTE
When chromosome surveys were done in the mid-1960s in British secure hospitals for the developmentally disabled, a higher than expected number of patients were found to have an extra Y chromosome. The patients were mischaracterized as aggressive and criminal, so that for a while an extra Y chromosome was believed to predispose a boy to antisocial behavior (and was dubbed the "criminal karyotype").


Again, I kinda liked this in films like Alien 3 and Cat O' Nine Tails. I don't think it was suggested though that evil people only had the DNA difference. It's just something like a double Y chromosome could produce really anti-social, violent behavior liking making you into a rapist or a serial killer. Maybe being a serial killer being suggested as bieng genetic is similar to wanting to be a super villain in the TS world.

TS of course refers to it as a "villain gene" so it's not the same thing exactly, but similar. People definitely suspect really crazy people of having some kind of DNA difference some how but it's not proven.

However, how this was implemented in the plot and "solved" was absolutely moronic.


I learned in bio class that having 2 y chromosomes was either really good or really bad... I cant remember, I just remember jotting notes down that day so I dont remember any details. The human mind fascinates me sometimes.

QUOTE
Not to mention Jerry living with his Mom is muy creepy. Would Season 1/2 Jerry do that? Hell no!


I have to agree with Syxx on this one, Sammie. It's been fairly cannon. Though when I stopped watching it for a while, I kind of forgot about it. So when I saw the ending and Jerry was staying with his mom I'm like:
"REALLY!!?!?!? This guy has grey hair and has a GINORMUS bald spot that I really couldn't say was intentional... whatever, the creator obviously just wanted Jerry to represent his life..."


Jerry's mum is a parody of the queen. She's like 84 and still gets around. I think that's how he can retire and still live with his mom. lol

And I meant evil people didn't have to have the double Y chromosome, but it produced certain insane behavior. That typo is corrected now. XD
Trillium
QUOTE (J-Syxx @ Jul 16 2010, 10:19 PM) *
TS of course refers to it as a "villain gene" so it's not the same thing exactly, but similar. People definitely suspect really crazy people of having some kind of DNA difference some how but it's not proven.


Like how the U.S. used to castrate criminals back in the 40s just in case being a criminal was "genetic", and their kids would be criminals too.

Pretty glad we don't do that anymore.
Stasis Muffin
First of all, Mandy's little chocolate chip cookies looked sorta tasty. I love cookies, and cookies baked by Mandy? Wouldn't that be interesting to try...


Yeah, the episode was a little silly. All the worlds evil being caused by a "villain gene" that can be neutralized by some nifty little device? I mean, honestly, that would be pretty awesome if something like that could actually be made...but hey, kinda hard to believe, you know? Still...look at it this way...you might think this could be an excuse for them to not be Spies anymore, but hey...doesn't eliminating all the evil in the world seem a little too good to be true? Like it wouldn't last...even a month or so? The girls even talked about if evil returns they would be ready to be super spies again! I think THAT leaves plenty of room for another season or something.

Since I usually care about some of the little things rather than the main plot, I'll go back to that. And I have quite a bit to say about it.
-Did anyone else think it was totally bizarre how the robot was throwing oranges at the Spies? It actually made me laugh it was so random.
-Contrary to the Samdyness of the previous episodes, it was Clover that wanted to help Mandy. Clover wanted to help Mandy after she was caught, and Clover didn't want to leave her with the robot. It was Sam that convinced Clover that they should leave Mandy and run away! If you really wanna stretch it, you could consider it as Sam being afraid of showing too much concern for Mandy that Clover and Alex would figure something out...
-I liked seeing Mandy trying to negotiate with the robot by offering it cookies.
-Did anyone else think it was interesting that the robot called Mandy a WOOHP agent? Either the robot just assumed that because she was hanging out with Sam, Clover, and Alex...or Jerry's Mom somehow knew that Mandy worked for WOOHP before?
-Speaking of Jerry's Mom, she was awesome and hot in that flashback. Pretty interesting little scene there.
-I think Britney's awesome for flying around with a jetpack while wearing a skirt. You don't see that too often!
-Those robots...it's like they knew that Sam, Clover, and Alex were the main characters and wanted to get everyone else out of the way first. Kind of amusing how those things happen.

And gosh, Sam, Clover, and Alex were meaner to Mandy in this episode than she's ever been to them in 5 seasons! Though usually their payback is meaner than what Mandy did anyway. Kind of ironic and even a bit hypocritical. I mean, Sam let the robot take her way so they could track it without being noticed, Clover made fun of the fact that they erased some of her memories several times, and Alex put a jetpack on her to send her back to Mali-U. And this is after she gave them back their parking space, bought them some shoes, cleaned their Penthouse, made them cookies, offered to fix Jerry's house, considered them best friends even after they used her as a human tracking device, helped "hold down the fort" with Jerry's Mom, and even cleaned Jerry's Mom's house a little.

Then I noticed something while looking at screenshots...there may have been another motive, at least from Alex.

Sam, Clover, and Alex are all looking up Mandy's skirt. Jerry and his "Mum" are all looking at her too, but not up her skirt like the Spies are.

Well, that's enough for now, those are my observations.
Ryofu
The credits says this two-parter was written by Robert and Michelle Lameroux. So maybe one of them wrote one episode and the other finished up with the second. It may explain why the Samdyness isn't exactly consistant.

QUOTE
First of all, Mandy's little chocolate chip cookies looked sorta tasty. I love cookies, and cookies baked by Mandy? Wouldn't that be interesting to try...


Strangely, this scene reminds me a of a scene from one of my TS yuri fics I wrote years ago. There was even apart about the cookies being diet or something I think. O__O

QUOTE
-I think Britney's awesome for flying around with a jetpack while wearing a skirt. You don't see that too often!


Too bad there wasn't a back shot or something, it would've made up for Britney basically doing nothing in this episode. lol

QUOTE
-Did anyone else think it was interesting that the robot called Mandy a WOOHP agent? Either the robot just assumed that because she was hanging out with Sam, Clover, and Alex...or Jerry's Mom somehow knew that Mandy worked for WOOHP before?


It was kinda weird. I assumed he was referring to the others. And I really want to see Mandy as a regular spy again. They kinda keep her as the girl's attachment to the "regular world." But it would be itneresting to see more of it the other way. Especially if it ends up with Sam and Mandy working together. z03.gif

QUOTE
-Speaking of Jerry's Mom, she was awesome and hot in that flashback. Pretty interesting little scene there.


Seems she was the regular sexpot in the 40's or whenever that was. XD
CrowSama
QUOTE (J-Syxx @ Aug 17 2010, 11:34 AM) *
QUOTE
-Speaking of Jerry's Mom, she was awesome and hot in that flashback. Pretty interesting little scene there.


Seems she was the regular sexpot in the 40's or whenever that was. XD


Chances are that when she was that hot that the sexiest thing was a flapper (1920's *thank you Thuroughly Modern Millie for making me remember the 20's*) who showed enough skin to about mid calf and almost one entire shoulder. As much skin as Jerry's mom showed in the flashback was probably forbidden.

Math lesson for the day:
Rebel+Secret Agent= omg.gif
Stasis Muffin
I think one of the robots called Mandy a WOOHP agent when it was carrying her over the ocean, when no actual WOOHP agents were in sight (though Sam, Clover, and Alex were close by)...it was after she offered it cookies.
"Collection droids do not eat cookies, nor do they negotiate with WOOHP agents." Or something like that. It's like Jerry's Mom knew she was a spy and programmed that information into the collection droids while she was "Mr. X"...if she was really a super spy, she might know that Mandy worked for WOOHP at one point. Though if she found that out, she'd probably know that it wasn't for very long!

Speaking of which, I totally dig Mandy's purple spy uniform, and really wish she got to use it more often. That was such an interesting idea that had so much more potential. I love this show, but the amount of wasted potential does bug me sometimes. It's why they should make Season 6!!

And like I said earlier, the ending of this episode doesn't really confirm any sort of concrete closure, other than I can imagine Jerry staying retired even if WOOHP was brought back after evil inevitably returns. I think there's a topic specifically for ideas about a Season 6 so I guess I'll just stop for now.
stephdumas
There one missing plothole. How the Spies menaged to be free from the robot and tying it to an anchor at the buttom of the river?

Also, I would had wished for an ending duel of the Spies vs one of their older ennemies: Terrance or even Tim Scam.
Trillium
QUOTE (stephdumas @ Aug 19 2010, 07:57 AM) *
There one missing plothole. How the Spies menaged to be free from the robot and tying it to an anchor at the buttom of the river?


A wizard did it.
CrowSama
QUOTE (Trillium @ Aug 19 2010, 05:31 PM) *
QUOTE (stephdumas @ Aug 19 2010, 07:57 AM) *
There one missing plothole. How the Spies menaged to be free from the robot and tying it to an anchor at the buttom of the river?


A wizard did it.


OoooOOOoh ITS MAGIC! Ya know! Never believe its not sooooo! musik30.gif
Stasis Muffin
Most robots don't seem to work well underwater in cartoons and stuff. I recall the most common way the Spies defeat robots is by making them fall in the water. The collection droids were pretty advanced, but that doesn't mean they have to know all their capabilities. Maybe they are weaker underwater? It thought it could drown them but it turned out to be a big mistake? Perhaps the Spies had an adrenaline rush due to one of the collection droids almost killing four of their friends mere moments ago and suddenly their own lives where in immediate danger, people can do some crazy things in desperate situations. It wasn't properly explained but I think it's not too hard to believe. I think something like what I described is what happened.

As for the idea of the finale having someone like Tim Scam...that's one thing I LOVED about this episode, it didn't have some lame villain like him being the "final boss" (Tim Scam really pisses me off for some reason) Sure, the main villain behind the problem in the last episodes being Jerry's Mom turned evil was a bit bizarre, but it's Totally Spies! That's what it does! Wacky villains are practically a staple! (that's one of the reasons I disliked Tim Scam, he seems like one of the most "normal" villains on the show, so he doesn't fit in...)
CrowSama
QUOTE (Stasis Muffin @ Aug 20 2010, 06:34 AM) *
Most robots don't seem to work well underwater in cartoons and stuff. I recall the most common way the Spies defeat robots is by making them fall in the water.


Ever seen Pokemon? team rockets giant robot is usualy electric resistant. its that whole "cartoon realisnm" factor lol. Same thing with any anime with godzilla-sized robots, they are water, electric and fire resistant. that makes few robots are prone to malfunction by water smile.gif
Trillium
QUOTE (CrowSama @ Aug 20 2010, 10:07 AM) *
Ever seen Pokemon? team rockets giant robot is usualy electric resistant. its that whole "cartoon realisnm" factor lol.


Well, considering how many times Pikachu's foiled their plans, you'd hope they'd learn something by now.

Still amazed at how stupid Ash, Dawn and Brock are for not knowing that it's just Team Rocket in disguise.
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